Reread what you just typed, Doc. "You could say that about 99% of pro team owners right now." Yes, a significant number of pro sports teams, save the NBA, have horrendous hiring practices for Black head coaches. Perhaps it's because the owners have been spectators as well. Our nation's past informs our present and our future. "60 years after the fact." Are you saying there's an expiration on progress? That's the comfort of privilege. And no one gets more benefit of doubt than wealthy men. "It happened long ago. Get over it." Dig into current grievances and you'll hit a root to our sordid past. And Jerry Jones, of all people, especially with his words and actions since 2016, hasn't earned the benefit of doubt.
I think it actually is a good analogy. Jerry Jones remains a spectator with social justice issues just as he was a spectator then. We don't know what he said or did then because he was only 14 but his record as an adult, and an old man, speaks for itself.
You could say that about 99 percent of pro sports team owners right now. To single out Jones 60 years after the fact helps no one and achieves nothing. Save the ammo for meaningful, current grievances.
Nice column, Doc. As I spent ~8 years trying to get my bachelor's degree back in the 70's , I spent a LOT of time on campus, way before the city school became the hyper cool modern campus it is today.
I figure this makes me a "loyal" Bearcat, but not really. The truth is, I brought my very young daughters to one UC football game a season ($7 / ducket at the gate), we sat right at the 50 yard line with a few thousand of the players families & roommates, and we were home before halftime. I thought this was great fun. I really liked Rick Minter, he was a nice guy, bumped into him at a few local watering holes. Nice hat, coach!
Then they hired Mark D'Antonio and I immediately bought season tickets. We all knew he wouldn't stay, it didnt matter this guy was the real deal. Brian Kelly was clearly a rocket ship when he stopped here for fuel. He flat out told us in his first press conference he would leave UC for one school, and one school only. (He lacked class when it happened, which sucked for his players). Butch started the slide & Tubby was just here for the cool uni's, that's my best guess.
Then comes Fickell, and I fell for it. It being the possibility he 'might be the one who stays & makes my school one of THE schools in college football'. I'm an optimist, always have been, and I swallowed this fly until it hooked my gills. Then he left. I get it, your column strikes the nail on the noggin but still, I was actually shocked. I am not easy to shock. Reality bites, but truth is, Fickell might really have been 'the guy' who made UC a perennial power. UC would have paid him a lot - how much is enough, coach?
Now, same old song & dance. I will still love going to the games and sitting in my great seats, but I won't swallow any more hooks. I'll try to enjoy the quasi-am games for what they are - a fund raiser.
Fickle (pun intended) can lose all of his games from here out, for all I care. He's just another, like the other others.
That's probably one of the most honest and accurate descriptions of how many of us feel. Well-written. Good work, Skip.
Yeah, I was hoping Fick would be the football version of Huggins, who stayed 16 years and had to be pried outta his chair at UC. Alas, not to be. A once superior recruiting class is seeing fast decomits, and this new coach lacks some of Fick's straight forwardness as well as deep Ohio connections. He already seems like another 3 year guy. He did have a recruiting class ranked #20, so maybe he can replace some of Fick's defectors with his own guys. We'll see. Disappointed is a good word to describe my feelings. Maybe it'll all work out in the end. It's frustrating, to be sure.
Put Huber in the Ring of Honor immediately after he chooses to retire. What an awesome career and how cool that he did it all here? I love it.
I know it's unlikely to change, but it sure would be nice if the NCAA changed the rules on when coaches can interview for new gigs. I think it's incredibly unfair to the players and fans for this kind of thing to go on during the season. There's a reason this stuff is not allowed to happen in the NFL or MLB. NCAA needs to implement some tampering rules.
I didn't care much for Jerry Jones before hearing about that picture and I still don't. I surely hope he's changed a lot since then. It's easy to judge those actions for sure. Most of us are sitting here thinking, "I wouldn't have done that." But the truth is...nobody can say that for sure. Times change, people change. Certainly not excusing it, just saying that sometimes judging things from the past using the standards of today is a slippery slope. He should certainly make a statement and apologize if he hasn't already. But that should be the end of it IMO.
Great one today. Totally agree on Fickell and Jones. One more point on Jones is no where does it show if he was active or a lookie-loo. Love your writing and insight even though you are normally wrong 😉
Did you read the rest of the article or just the lead up? Because it's really lazy on your part if you just read the blurb and not the rest. You're doing what you accused the writer of doing: being misleading.
I read it again to make sure I wasn't missing anything. I wasn't. Hill says the picture explains why the NFL has a hiring problem. She doesn't deviate from that. "Where Jones stands today on matters of race and prejudice isn’t entirely clear,'' Hill writes. She makes it clear where she thinks he stands. Point is, Jones at 14 was not Jones at 79. Implying otherwise only slows progress. And there's no doubt the NFL needs progress. Thanks for writing.
Jerry Jones’ explanation was that he was curious, a bystander and a knucklehead. What I would have like to have heard from JJ was that it was a huge mistake, he was sorry and regretted being in that group blocking the black students’ entrance to the school. And to acknowledge it was ugly racism against black students. Having said that I don’t believe Jerry Jones is a racist now, maybe not then, but I still would have liked to seen more acknowledgement and more empathy of that event 65 years ago.
It's ironic that the topics of feigned loyalty and the departure of Kevin Huber appear in the same blog. Bravo to the hometown product of McNick and UC who spent his entire punting career in Cincinnati.
You would get a kick out of the local coverage here in N Colorado of Deion Sanders accepting the coaching job at 1-11 University of Colorado Boulder. Even Mike Zimmer’s name has popped up as a member of “Coach Prime’s” staff; that is, if the AD can now find all the dollars to pay Neon.
In trying to ascertain some semblance of who these guys are from their actions and words, one could do way worse than to take a little trip down memory lane - two years ago to the day, to be precise - for the coverage of Satterfield's epically bungled dalliance with South Carolina just briefly into his L'ville "career".
“We’re a program where we don’t have to talk about family, we just are family,” he told me on the eve of his first spring game in Louisville. “I’ve been hearing places (say): ‘We’re a family, we’re all about family,’ that ain’t really about family. I think it’s just the way that I was brought up in the coaching profession.”
The only thing that old picture of J Jones proves to me is that, at that time and place in his life, he was common - and a conformist. Neither of those traits is impressive. But neither are they smoking guns in the case of his - or the NFL's racism. Nepotism has launched and extended the careers of well-connected mediocrities since Noah's brother-in-law built his arc for him. It is also the primary force behind what appear to be racist hiring practices. And even if it is less heinous than racism, the NFL needs to address it.
Does every college coach seek a “better” job? Are columnists and regional sales guys (me) the only people who love what they do and where they do (did) it? It seems that with UC entering the Big XII - and having success - some very good coach just might want to stay.
Maybe basketball coaches are different. I’ll always have mixed feelings about Bob Huggins, but I believe he would have stayed at UC. And he’s been at his Alma Mater, West Virginia, for a good long while now.
Ask Kansas State fans what they think about Huggy Bear. They hired him when he needed his reputation rehabilitated, and I think he stayed for 1 year. He jumped ship as soon as WVU came calling.
Doc, if you're looking for some good listening, may I suggest Neal Francis? Up and coming keys player out of Chicago. His band is a blend of 70's era funk/r&b/blues. Based on your Tune o' the Day choices, I think you might really enjoy it.
Reread what you just typed, Doc. "You could say that about 99% of pro team owners right now." Yes, a significant number of pro sports teams, save the NBA, have horrendous hiring practices for Black head coaches. Perhaps it's because the owners have been spectators as well. Our nation's past informs our present and our future. "60 years after the fact." Are you saying there's an expiration on progress? That's the comfort of privilege. And no one gets more benefit of doubt than wealthy men. "It happened long ago. Get over it." Dig into current grievances and you'll hit a root to our sordid past. And Jerry Jones, of all people, especially with his words and actions since 2016, hasn't earned the benefit of doubt.
I think it actually is a good analogy. Jerry Jones remains a spectator with social justice issues just as he was a spectator then. We don't know what he said or did then because he was only 14 but his record as an adult, and an old man, speaks for itself.
You could say that about 99 percent of pro sports team owners right now. To single out Jones 60 years after the fact helps no one and achieves nothing. Save the ammo for meaningful, current grievances.
Nice column, Doc. As I spent ~8 years trying to get my bachelor's degree back in the 70's , I spent a LOT of time on campus, way before the city school became the hyper cool modern campus it is today.
I figure this makes me a "loyal" Bearcat, but not really. The truth is, I brought my very young daughters to one UC football game a season ($7 / ducket at the gate), we sat right at the 50 yard line with a few thousand of the players families & roommates, and we were home before halftime. I thought this was great fun. I really liked Rick Minter, he was a nice guy, bumped into him at a few local watering holes. Nice hat, coach!
Then they hired Mark D'Antonio and I immediately bought season tickets. We all knew he wouldn't stay, it didnt matter this guy was the real deal. Brian Kelly was clearly a rocket ship when he stopped here for fuel. He flat out told us in his first press conference he would leave UC for one school, and one school only. (He lacked class when it happened, which sucked for his players). Butch started the slide & Tubby was just here for the cool uni's, that's my best guess.
Then comes Fickell, and I fell for it. It being the possibility he 'might be the one who stays & makes my school one of THE schools in college football'. I'm an optimist, always have been, and I swallowed this fly until it hooked my gills. Then he left. I get it, your column strikes the nail on the noggin but still, I was actually shocked. I am not easy to shock. Reality bites, but truth is, Fickell might really have been 'the guy' who made UC a perennial power. UC would have paid him a lot - how much is enough, coach?
Now, same old song & dance. I will still love going to the games and sitting in my great seats, but I won't swallow any more hooks. I'll try to enjoy the quasi-am games for what they are - a fund raiser.
Fickle (pun intended) can lose all of his games from here out, for all I care. He's just another, like the other others.
Go Bearcats!
Skip Doyle
Miami View Golf Club
;)
That's probably one of the most honest and accurate descriptions of how many of us feel. Well-written. Good work, Skip.
Yeah, I was hoping Fick would be the football version of Huggins, who stayed 16 years and had to be pried outta his chair at UC. Alas, not to be. A once superior recruiting class is seeing fast decomits, and this new coach lacks some of Fick's straight forwardness as well as deep Ohio connections. He already seems like another 3 year guy. He did have a recruiting class ranked #20, so maybe he can replace some of Fick's defectors with his own guys. We'll see. Disappointed is a good word to describe my feelings. Maybe it'll all work out in the end. It's frustrating, to be sure.
Put Huber in the Ring of Honor immediately after he chooses to retire. What an awesome career and how cool that he did it all here? I love it.
I know it's unlikely to change, but it sure would be nice if the NCAA changed the rules on when coaches can interview for new gigs. I think it's incredibly unfair to the players and fans for this kind of thing to go on during the season. There's a reason this stuff is not allowed to happen in the NFL or MLB. NCAA needs to implement some tampering rules.
I didn't care much for Jerry Jones before hearing about that picture and I still don't. I surely hope he's changed a lot since then. It's easy to judge those actions for sure. Most of us are sitting here thinking, "I wouldn't have done that." But the truth is...nobody can say that for sure. Times change, people change. Certainly not excusing it, just saying that sometimes judging things from the past using the standards of today is a slippery slope. He should certainly make a statement and apologize if he hasn't already. But that should be the end of it IMO.
Absolutely love your work sir, informative and enjoyable, yourself and Hal McCoy make my day
Great one today. Totally agree on Fickell and Jones. One more point on Jones is no where does it show if he was active or a lookie-loo. Love your writing and insight even though you are normally wrong 😉
Hope to God at 59 I’m never held accountable at what I did at 14. Hell I can’t remember what I did at 30!
I'm forever grateful that cell phones and social media didn't exist when I was a teenager!
The only person with a cell phone when I was 14 was James Bond. 🤣
Exactly
Did you read the rest of the article or just the lead up? Because it's really lazy on your part if you just read the blurb and not the rest. You're doing what you accused the writer of doing: being misleading.
I read it again to make sure I wasn't missing anything. I wasn't. Hill says the picture explains why the NFL has a hiring problem. She doesn't deviate from that. "Where Jones stands today on matters of race and prejudice isn’t entirely clear,'' Hill writes. She makes it clear where she thinks he stands. Point is, Jones at 14 was not Jones at 79. Implying otherwise only slows progress. And there's no doubt the NFL needs progress. Thanks for writing.
Jerry Jones’ explanation was that he was curious, a bystander and a knucklehead. What I would have like to have heard from JJ was that it was a huge mistake, he was sorry and regretted being in that group blocking the black students’ entrance to the school. And to acknowledge it was ugly racism against black students. Having said that I don’t believe Jerry Jones is a racist now, maybe not then, but I still would have liked to seen more acknowledgement and more empathy of that event 65 years ago.
Fair
It's ironic that the topics of feigned loyalty and the departure of Kevin Huber appear in the same blog. Bravo to the hometown product of McNick and UC who spent his entire punting career in Cincinnati.
You would get a kick out of the local coverage here in N Colorado of Deion Sanders accepting the coaching job at 1-11 University of Colorado Boulder. Even Mike Zimmer’s name has popped up as a member of “Coach Prime’s” staff; that is, if the AD can now find all the dollars to pay Neon.
In trying to ascertain some semblance of who these guys are from their actions and words, one could do way worse than to take a little trip down memory lane - two years ago to the day, to be precise - for the coverage of Satterfield's epically bungled dalliance with South Carolina just briefly into his L'ville "career".
December 7, 2020
https://theathletic.com/2245489/2020/12/07/scott-satterfield-louisville-south-carolina/
“We’re a program where we don’t have to talk about family, we just are family,” he told me on the eve of his first spring game in Louisville. “I’ve been hearing places (say): ‘We’re a family, we’re all about family,’ that ain’t really about family. I think it’s just the way that I was brought up in the coaching profession.”
December 6, 2020
https://www.wdrb.com/sports/bozich-satterfield-has-played-this-like-a-guy-who-should-go-to-south-carolina/article_e63472ca-371f-11eb-b393-a33804de22a8.html
The only thing that old picture of J Jones proves to me is that, at that time and place in his life, he was common - and a conformist. Neither of those traits is impressive. But neither are they smoking guns in the case of his - or the NFL's racism. Nepotism has launched and extended the careers of well-connected mediocrities since Noah's brother-in-law built his arc for him. It is also the primary force behind what appear to be racist hiring practices. And even if it is less heinous than racism, the NFL needs to address it.
I'm sure the son of the Senator will get right on that.
I thought Coach Fickel was waiting in for the Ohio State job to open up. He still might still be. Best of luck to him.
My guess is that him taking the Wisconsin job didn’t remove him from Gene Smith’s OSU football coach short list.
Does every college coach seek a “better” job? Are columnists and regional sales guys (me) the only people who love what they do and where they do (did) it? It seems that with UC entering the Big XII - and having success - some very good coach just might want to stay.
Money, ego, money, ambition, money.
What about the coaches who never leave? At what point is Boeheim doing a disservice to that program?
It's an earned disservice
Maybe basketball coaches are different. I’ll always have mixed feelings about Bob Huggins, but I believe he would have stayed at UC. And he’s been at his Alma Mater, West Virginia, for a good long while now.
Ask Kansas State fans what they think about Huggy Bear. They hired him when he needed his reputation rehabilitated, and I think he stayed for 1 year. He jumped ship as soon as WVU came calling.
Doc, if you're looking for some good listening, may I suggest Neal Francis? Up and coming keys player out of Chicago. His band is a blend of 70's era funk/r&b/blues. Based on your Tune o' the Day choices, I think you might really enjoy it.